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Post by plbyrd on May 3, 2006 21:32:46 GMT -5
I've just never been able to work through the issues with the interaction between DMBBS and TCPSER4J which causes the bbs to crash at least every other day. On top of that, a new problem has arrisen in code that I cannot modify that's causing the BBS to crash after every call. Short of resetting the whole BBS and starting from scratch I can't keep the BBS up and running.
So, I'm going to take down Da Bored for now. Maybe I can get TCPSER4J and DMBBS to play nice at some point with DMBBS V5, but for now I don't have the time and energy to put into it. I've also started writing a new bbs that I would rather put that energy into. I was hoping that DMBBS would be at least servicable until that new system is ready, but as of now it just isn't feasible.
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Post by Golan Klinger on May 4, 2006 0:18:31 GMT -5
Have you considered running a different BBS program until you complete your own BBS software? What about ditching TCPSER4J and going with Leif's BBS Server? Quite a few folks are using it successfully and judging by your blog, I'm confident you've got a Windows machine kicking around somewhere. I hate the idea of having to repost the BBS list minus a board.  |
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Post by Excalibur on May 4, 2006 5:39:14 GMT -5
 Unfortunately BBS Server isn't compatible with DM. I think it has something to do with it outputting responses in verbose and DM not being able to read them <sigh>. Could be wrong but I think that's what it was. I know I spent hours trying to get it to work before switching to tcpserv. V5 doesn't appear to have any real issues with tcpserv except every great once in a while it won't reset the board but this has not happened alot. I'm still trying to get some of the old programmers together to make some drastic modifications to DMBBS but so far I haven't either been able to locate my old buddies or they haven't expressed the interest. So unfortunately it's still up to me...the guy who hasn't programmed in basic for 10 years and is still learning ml. Hopefully Payton will wake up one night in a cold sweat and realize how painful it would be for Golan to have to modify the bbs list  .
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Post by plbyrd on May 4, 2006 7:03:10 GMT -5
Unfortunately it's not a single problem, but an onion full of problems. Fix one and there's another. The time it takes to put together a BBS is not insignificant, even with pre-existing software such as Centipede. I have the hardware to make Centipede sing, but not the desire. Part of why I put Da Bored! back up was the desire to run DMBBS again. 10+ years of not running DMBBS had made some pretty rose-colored glasses to look through and now I remember why I switched to Renegade on PC so many years ago.
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Post by Golan Klinger on May 4, 2006 7:59:37 GMT -5
I've also started writing a new bbs that I would rather put that energy into. Can you tell us more about this? Is this new BBS 64-based? The reason I was suggesting using alternate software, server or BBS, was that once a board goes down it is often difficult to get users to return once it goes back up. If your raison d'etre was to run DMBBS then I guess you're out of steam. Should I make a notation that your board is down temporarily or remove it from the list completely? |
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Post by Cyberjank on May 4, 2006 10:10:37 GMT -5
I have the hardware to make Centipede sing, but not the desire. Part of why I put Da Bored! back up was the desire to run DMBBS again. Pffft, so what are you trying to say? |
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Post by Golan Klinger on May 4, 2006 11:53:13 GMT -5
Pffft, so what are you trying to say? You have to read between the lines. He's saying it would be pointless for him to put up a BBS running Centipede because there's no way he could come close to anything as cool as Mad World.  Love the new avatar, BTW. Chet rocks. |
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Post by plbyrd on May 4, 2006 19:57:16 GMT -5
As awesome as Centipede is, it's still running in CBM Basic and ML. At this point in my life I just find it to be a chore to write CBM Basic, even on the 128 (actually, especially on the 128, it's sooo slow when memory starts to get tight). I write code all day and I've grown into a style of programming with C# that's not really reasonable with Commodores. This isn't a knock on Commodore, it's just a testament to how far things have come in the last 20 years.
The new BBS I'm writing is written in C# and has a very rich asynchronous Object Oriented programming model to it. Menu items are delegates and menus are defined as XML files, including the capability to use PETSCII, ATASCII, ASCII, and ANSI specific versions of strings. All the text files are similar XML files. The user, message, and file base data is all SQL Server based. There's a complete API for game development. The BBS runs as a Windows service and will be able to handle as many simultaneous users as the hardware will allow. Visual Studio 2005 just gives me so many powerful tools that I can get so much more done in a day than I could accomplish in a week of programming on the Commodore.
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Post by Cyberjank on May 5, 2006 9:03:06 GMT -5
Golan : Thanks for the kind words, yeah Chet does rule, lol..... Payton : As awesome as Centipede is, it's still running in CBM Basic and ML. At this point in my life I just find it to be a chore to write CBM Basic, even on the 128 (actually, especially on the 128, it's sooo slow when memory starts to get tight). I write code all day and I've grown into a style of programming with C# that's not really reasonable with Commodores. This isn't a knock on Commodore, it's just a testament to how far things have come in the last 20 years. The new BBS I'm writing is written in C# and has a very rich asynchronous Object Oriented programming model to it. Menu items are delegates and menus are defined as XML files, including the capability to use PETSCII, ATASCII, ASCII, and ANSI specific versions of strings. All the text files are similar XML files. The user, message, and file base data is all SQL Server based. There's a complete API for game development. The BBS runs as a Windows service and will be able to handle as many simultaneous users as the hardware will allow. Visual Studio 2005 just gives me so many powerful tools that I can get so much more done in a day than I could accomplish in a week of programming on the Commodore. I don't think there was ever a question of what development software was superior between PC's and C='s After all, the C= era is over with and the *reason* we're on C='s is for fun, not ease of use or easier development. CJ |
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Post by plbyrd on May 6, 2006 14:42:08 GMT -5
At this point I'm not finding it "fun" to write software on the C=. Call me spoiled if you want. Maybe if I didn't spend 40+ hours per week programming it might be different.
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Post by Golan Klinger on May 6, 2006 15:28:55 GMT -5
At this point I'm not finding it "fun" to write software on the C=. Different strokes for different folks. I find programming the 64 to be quite cathartic. Admittedly, I'm doing it in an emulator so I have a variety of tools at my disposable and I can spawn new emulators to test things without breaking my rhythm. In that regard, I'm spoiled too. I don't know if I would be singing this tune if I was still using an actual 64. |
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Post by Excalibur on May 6, 2006 20:26:44 GMT -5
I can more than see Payton's side of the story, even though I don't like his going offline. I think some it to is the somewhat low response of callers. If you make a ton of changes and nobody calls then you're kind of stuck sitting there asking yourself "and why did I do this?" I'm already tired of the commodore myself but my passion is DMBBS. If I can ever get DM fully functional in an emulator then more than likely I'll get rid of my commodore gear. Besides, if running in an emulator ever comes to fruition there no telling how many commodore boards will come back online. Just wish Payton hadn't thrown in the towel so soon is all.
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Post by Cyberjank on May 8, 2006 10:04:04 GMT -5
I can more than see Payton's side of the story, even though I don't like his going offline. I think some it to is the somewhat low response of callers. If you make a ton of changes and nobody calls then you're kind of stuck sitting there asking yourself "and why did I do this?" I'm already tired of the commodore myself but my passion is DMBBS. If I can ever get DM fully functional in an emulator then more than likely I'll get rid of my commodore gear. Besides, if running in an emulator ever comes to fruition there no telling how many commodore boards will come back online. Just wish Payton hadn't thrown in the towel so soon is all. Welp, I dont know about you, but my BBS cost's about $30 cents a month to run. Or some other terribly low number. Nobody says I "HAVE" to innovate, though it's important to do so. When I start to get burned out, I turn off the monitor and catch a movie, or get outside. Even if people don't call, it does not hurt to be there. So for me, I really think this is the key to longevity. People can complain that it's not innovative and will not attract callers. I can say, I'm retaining my love for C= without burnout. CJ |
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Post by Jeff Ledger on May 8, 2006 22:57:49 GMT -5
I've said it before... The whole point of this hobby is to have fun... If you're not enjoying it, then it's time to get a new hobby. My C=/Electronics hobby provides me a wonderful escape from the pressures of real life, a time to mentally unwind. I tend to spend time in spurts with my C= stuff, wander away as I get my fill for a few weeks, then spend time with it as am ready again. At the moment, I'm on a PICaxe & C=/MAC Emulation kick, and enjoying the heck out of it. Last month I was spending countless hours working on the BBS, and I've got a pretty good idea that CML needs some serious attention again next month.. At some point, I typically come "full circle" and will be spending hours again on the BBS. This is why Temporal Vortex has been in development in gaps for the last three years. But then, it's a hobby.. Do this stuff because you enjoy it! You might notice if you watch closely, that some of our "notables" do this the same way, and it's ok. When the mood strikes you, go outside... It's nice out there! (My SX has been begging me to go play some games on the front porch some evening soon.. ) Jeff |
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Post by plbyrd on May 9, 2006 15:08:24 GMT -5
Jeff, you are so completely right. The point is to have fun. Running a BBS is a bit of a responsibility and when it has issues that correspond to a lack of time/motivation to have fixing it, it becomes a royal PITA.
I want everyone right now to understand that this decision had nothing to do with call volume. I was perfectly happy with the call volume as there was actually a very spirited game of Empire going on and I hate it for the guys who were calling every day and the bbs was crashing on them. I just have sooo much going on in my life between family, work, school and my rental properties that the C= is WAY down the priority list; so much so that it was neglected.
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