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Post by robertb on Sept 27, 2005 18:43:06 GMT -5
Hurrah, my PAL DTV arrived in the mail yesterday! The Argos chain store had sent it to my British friend in a bag (!), but my friend then sent it on to me in a well-packed shipping box (a Stella Artois box!). Just an external examination of the PAL DTV package right now. It comes in the pyramidal packaging of old, in comparison to the current, hexagonal packaging of the NTSC DTV. It is listed as "Item# 89000". On all four sides and the bottom, it is logoed, "the toy: lobster company" (yes, no caps). More information on the bottom gives details of Toy Lobster and Argos: The Toy: Lobster Company Ltd. PO Box 2078 Hockley, Essex SS5 4WZ UK Telephone: 0870 240 8694 (Monday-Friday, 9:00am - 5:00pm except Bank Holidays) [snip] If calling from overseas, call: 00 44 1702 208130 c2005, The Toy:Lobster Company Ltd. All Rights Reserved. www.toylobster.comArgos Limited 489-499 Avebury Boulevard, Saxon Gate West, Central Milton Keynes, MK0 2NW, U.K. The DC Studios and Ironstone Partners logos and 2005 copyrights are also on the package bottom. Also, "C64 and Commodore 64 are trademarks of COMMODORE INTERNATIONAL BV, used under license." The informational card on the rear of the packaging tells of the 30 games in the joystick, some games which are different than the NTSC DTV. Here is the list: Impossible Mission Jumpman Jr. Cybernoid 2 Paradroid Pitstop 2 Gateway to Apshai Cyberdyne Warrior Uridium California Games ---Half Pipe ---Foot Bag ---Surfing ---Roller Skating ---BMX ---Flying Disk Winter Games ---Hot Dog ---Biathlon ---Speed Skating ---Figure Skating ---Ski Jump ---Bobsled World Games ---Barrel Jumping ---Cliff Diving ---Bull Riding ---Caber Toss ---Sumo Wrestling ---Weight Lifting I'll tell more when I open the pyramid! Robert Bernardo Fresno Commodore User Group videocam.net.au/fcug
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Post by robertb on Sept 28, 2005 15:18:55 GMT -5
Argos Limited 489-499 Avebury Boulevard, Saxon Gate West, Central Milton Keynes, MK0 2NW, U.K. That postal code should be MK9 2NW The informational card on the rear of the packaging tells of the 30 games in the joystick, some games which are different than the NTSC DTV. Here is the list: [snip] Ay, an Argos sticker covered part of the informational card! When I opened the pyramidal packaging, the card also listed the following: Summer Games ---Pole Vault ---Diving ---Gymnastics ---Skeet Shooting By the way, the Argos sticker read, BOYS TOYS / ELECTRONIC BOYS 369/1715(D) P/O 748529 The "Set-up Guide and Play Instructions" in the PAL DTV were different than the "Installation Guide and Instructions" that came with the NTSC DTV. The PAL instructions had a 3+ and a 5+ (age?) rating with a website listed at www.pegi.info The PAL instructions had 4 small photos showing how to install the batteries, whereas the NTSC instructions had no such photos. Warning, requirements, and tips for set-up were basically the same between the two, though the PAL instructions included a warning paragraph for those who suffer from epilepsy and seizures. More to report later, Robert Bernardo Fresno Commodore User Group videocam.net.au/fcug
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Post by robertb on Sept 29, 2005 14:12:14 GMT -5
The PAL DTV's exterior looks virtually the same as the NTSC DTV's exterior. On the bottom of the PAL DTV casing, it still has the 2004 Mammoth / N.S.I. copyright. It has a number engraved in the bottom - 050709. The labeling on top is all the same - the same, painted ABCD letters by their respective buttons, the reset label in relief, the same Mammoth Toys sticker, the same L/R painted next to the fire buttons, and the italicized C=64 sticker facing the a/v cord. After I load 4 lithium AA 1.5 volt batteries into the DTV and plug the a/v cable into a 13-inch Magnovox RGB Monitor 80 switched to composite (CVBS), I power up the DTV and the monitor. Definitely, I have a PAL DTV; the NTSC monitor outputs black-and-white video and has a moderate case of vertical rolling. The Magnavox has no apparent vertical roll control, and so, I go to my NTSC Sears 20-inch t.v./RGB/composite monitor. My Sansui DVD recorder is connected to the Sears; I connect the PAL DTV to the input jacks of the DVD recorder and turn on the Sears, Sansui, and DTV. Success! The opening C= screen appears in color; I won't have to break out my PAL t.v./monitor out of storage. However, the start-up of the PAL DTV is different. After the first 4-second C= screen, there appears a DC Studios splash screen for 4 seconds, followed by "the toy: lobster company" logo screen for 4 seconds, followed by the Mammoth Toys logo for 4 seconds, and followed by the copyrights screen for 6 seconds. The 2005 copyrights screen has the same listing of companies: Mammoth Toys, Digital Concepts DC Studios, Ironstone Partners Ltd, and the Toy: Lobster Company Ltd. In comparison, the NTSC DTV just has the 4-second C= screen followed by the 6-second 2004 copyrights screen. Both the NTSC and PAL DTVs have the opening C64 desktop with the animated LOAD"*",8,1 / RUN sequence which kicks them into the games selection screen. From power-up to the games selection screen, the PAL DTV takes 39-49 seconds. The NTSC DTV takes 20 seconds. The PAL DTV's games selection screen has the same music, horizontally-scrolling starfield, and message scrolly (though I will be studying the message scroll to see if there are really any changes). The DTV's video output is clear and stable. The joystick feels adequate, i.e., it responds well in all 4 directions. On Wed, 28 Sep 2005, I wrote: > The informational card on the rear of the packaging > tells of the 30 games in the joystick, some games > which are different than [those in] the NTSC DTV. On the PAL DTV's games selection screen, there are a number of games not listed on the informational card of the DTV's packaging. The selection menu has the following games. Alleykat California Games Championship Wrestling Cyberdyne Warrior Cybernoid Cybernoid II Eliminator Exolon Firelord Gateway to Apshai Head the Ball Impossible Mission Impossible Mission 2 Jumpman Jr. Marauder Maze Mania Mission Impossibubble Nebulus Netherworld Paradroid Pitstop Pitstop 2 Ranarama Speedball Summer Games SuperCycle Sword of Fargoal Uridium Winter Games Zynaps The PAL DTV's "Set-up Guide and Play Instructions" have abbreviated instructions for all of the above games and for the games "within games", i.e., California Games, Summer Games, and Winter Games. However, the informational card also lists the World Games, which includes Barrel Jumping, Cliff Diving, Bull Riding, Caber Toss, Sumo Wrestling, and Weight Lifting. Neither the PAL DTV's games selection menu nor the instructions have the World Games! Even more of a surprise... I could not access the "secret" second screen! In the NTSC DTV, upon start-up, you must waggle the joystick from left to right, and this would give you a C64 desktop with the animated command sequence, LOAD"$", 8 and LIST. From there, you could access the BASIC prompt with its virtual keyboard, play 6 extra games, and issue commands to get you to various hidden features (Easter eggs). On the PAL DTV, I tried 7 times to get to the second screen, but the start-up sequence was the same -- no second screen, just the eventual games selection screen. That leaves several questions. What has happened to World Games? Is the secret second screen still there? If it is, how is it now accessed? If it's not there, how are the Easter eggs accessed? Are the Easter eggs still there? I remember Jeri telling me that several Easter eggs would be removed, Robert Bernardo Fresno Commodore User Group videocam.net.au/fcugP.S. From a message on rec.games.video.classic, I was advised to waggle the joystick more slowly to gain access. I will try that tonight.
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Post by Methanoid on Sept 30, 2005 2:14:48 GMT -5
More importantly.. is there a way to remove all those crap logos and shorten the bootup time.. who wants to wait best part of a minute before playing.. I thought it was "Plug n Play" not "Plug n Wait n Play"
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Post by weirdocollector on Sept 30, 2005 5:00:04 GMT -5
More importantly.. is there a way to remove all those crap logos and shorten the bootup time.. who wants to wait best part of a minute before playing.. I thought it was "Plug n Play" not "Plug n Wait n Play" Wiggle the joystich left-right to go directly to the LOAD "*",8,1 without the need to display the logos. Wiggle the joystick in all the four directions (just 'rotate' it) to glo to the LOAD "$",8,1 sequence.
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Post by robertb on Sept 30, 2005 12:34:23 GMT -5
Wiggle the joystich left-right to go directly to the LOAD "*",8,1 without the need to display the logos. No, that doesn't work. Wiggle the joystick in all the four directions (just 'rotate' it) to go to the LOAD "$",8,1 sequence. I'll try that method and let you know. Truly, Robert Bernardo Fresno Commodore User Group videocam.net.au/fcug
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Post by Robin Harbron on Sept 30, 2005 19:00:59 GMT -5
More importantly.. is there a way to remove all those crap logos and shorten the bootup time.. You only have to wait for the logos each time you power-up. After that (as long as you've gone into a game once) hitting reset will bring you right to the blue screen (which you can speed up by holding down fire).
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Post by robertb on Oct 8, 2005 16:09:48 GMT -5
Hurrah! I got back to testing out the PAL DTV from the U.K., and I can now reliably get into the second "secret" screen of the unit. Thanks to all who have advised me on the various ways to access the secret screen. I've found that revolving the joystick handle clockwise or counter-clockwise (anti-clockwise) nearly always gets me into that screen. As mentioned before in a previous message, the Basic Prompt, Minima Reloaded, Splatform, DWCave, Cliff Diving, and Tinyrinth are listed on the second screen. I've tried them out, and they work fine, just as in the NTSC version. (Ah, nice to have the Basic Prompt with its virtual keyboard.) Now that I'm able to get into the second screen, I will see whether or not the Easter eggs of the NTSC version are present in the PAL version. On Fri, 30 Sep 2005, MagerValp wrote: > Try holding down a combination of the A-D buttons instead. I tried various combinations but never got into the second screen by that method. However, by holding down the A and the D buttons, I got into a "test" screen, which displayed the 16 colors on the left with a kind of joystick grid on the right with which to test the various joystick directions and the the firebuttons (hey, sound effects!) Truly, Robert Bernardo Fresno Commodore User Group videocam.net.au/fcug
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Post by robertb on Oct 11, 2005 0:40:19 GMT -5
I've looked through the published NTSC DTV Easter eggs and rechecked to see if they were present in the PAL DTV. I can now verify the following: (refer to the thread, C64 DTV Software Secrets Summarized) Tip 01 -- Functions the same as in the NTSC DTV Tip 02 -- Had to revolve the joystick handle rather than waggling it from left to right in order to access the PAL DTV secret screen Tip 03 -- Functions the same as in the NTSC DTV. Tip 04 -- Functions the same as in the NTSC DTV. Tip 05 -- Functions the same as in the NTSC DTV. Tip 06 -- Functions the same as in the NTSC DTV. Tip 07 -- Functions the same as in the NTSC DTV. In the PAL DTV, at the end of the directory listing, the date reads, "2005 06 07 03:21:11" or in other words, June 7, 2005, 3:21:11 a.m.. In the NTSC DTV, the date reads, "2004 09 14 20:51:34" -- September 14, 2004, 8:51:34 p.m.. Tip 08 -- No Entropy demo in the PAL DTV. After my following the commands in order to run the demo, all that is reported is "?FILE NOT FOUND ERROR IN 0". Tip 09: Because there is no Entropy demo, this tip no longer pertains. Tip 10: No Docviewer for programming info. After my following the commands in order to load it, all that is reported is "?FILE NOT FOUND ERROR". After a RUN command is issued, the PAL DTV reports with a READY and the blinking cursor. Tip 11: Functions the same as in the NTSC DTV Tip 12: Functions the same as in the NTSC DTV Tip 13: No photo of the Commodore legend. After my following the commands in order to run it, all that is seen is a black screen. Tip 14: No photo of the DTV Team. After my following the commands in order to run it, all that is seen is a black screen. Extra tip -- ?MV$ functions the same as in the NTSC DTV. Truly, Robert Bernardo Fresno Commodore User Group videocam.net.au/fcug
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Post by Leeeeee on Oct 11, 2005 4:30:13 GMT -5
On my PAL DTV the photo is present, exactly as on the NTSC version.
Lee.
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Post by Captn Bobby on Oct 11, 2005 14:01:25 GMT -5
Interesting. Did you get your PAL DTV from Toy: Lobster in Essex, England? Truly, Robert Bernardo Fresno Commodore User Group videocam.net.au/fcug
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Post by Captn Bobby on Oct 11, 2005 14:05:53 GMT -5
I wrote: I should be more exact... did you get your PAL DTV which was distributed from Toy: Lobster in Essex, England to its retailers? Truly, Robert Bernardo Fresno Commodore User Group videocam.net.au/fcug
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Post by robertb on Oct 17, 2005 1:06:58 GMT -5
The following is an edited e-conversation between Jeri Ellsworth and myself, held on Saturday, October 15, at the #c64friends chat on irc.eskimo.com She answers certain PAL DTV questions.
RobertB> Jeri, I'm going to crack open my PAL DTV tomorrow. Anything I should be looking for? :-)
Jeri0p> The PAL DTV is less, less friendly to work on than the NTSC. I couldn't get everything on test points, so you have to solder to small resistors.
RobertB> Ooo, I wouldn't know where to begin, Jeri. :-) However, is it true that the PDF's for it are entirely different than what is currently on the board?
Jeri0p> The PDF should be mostly correct. They just took some stuff out and renamed a few parts.
RobertB> Jeri, there was a question that whether the F7 bug in the DTV has been fixed in the PAL version. Nick Coplin had that question. Was it fixed?
Jeri0p> I think f7 is still messed up.
RobertB> Jeri, why is the PAL DTV board less friendly? Is it because of the penny-pinchers at Mammoth Toys?
Jeri0p> I don't think it was the penny-pinching this time. More like they could see the need to spend an extra minutes laying out the test points.
RobertB> Oh, [then] they made it that way to facilitate faster DTV production. And so, faster production means more efficiency which means saved money.
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Post by robertb on Oct 19, 2005 17:49:17 GMT -5
The PAL DTV's games selection screen has the same music, horizontally-scrolling starfield, and message scrolly (though I will be studying the message scroll to see if there are really any changes). I've studied the message scroll in both the NTSC C64 DTV and the PAL C64 DTV. There are differences. Before I detail the differences, the NTSC DTV that I am using as my base reference was received from the QVC television shopping cannel in December, 2004. I have not studied the latest NTSC DTV revision A5 (bought July, 2005) from Toys 'R US to see whether its message scroll has changed, too. The scroll on the reference NTSC DTV reads -- (all in caps) The Commodore 64 Team - DC Studios - Executive Producer: Mark Greenshields - Producer: Marie-Jo Leroux -- Lead Programmer: Robin Harbron - Programmers: Adrian Gonzalez Per Olofsson Mark Seelye - Documentation: Jason Compton - Hardware: Jeri Ellsworth - Menu Fonts: Matthew Wooley - Menu Music: Andrew Lemon -- Ironstone - Executive Producers: Paul Gouge and Darren Melbourne -- Mammoth Toys - Executive Producers - Frank Landi and Brian Waldman From the first sight of the first workd to the sight of the last word on the scrool, the duration is approximately 1 minute. The PAL DTV has a message scroll of approximately 1 minute, 45 seconds, the added time being due to the following changes/additions -- - Producers: Marie-Jo Leroux and Jeff Glasson (after Menu Music: Andrew Lemon) - Menu Artist: Shaun McClure - Quality Assurance: Jonathan D'Anjou (after Ironstone - Executive Producers: Paul Gouge and Darren Melbourne) -- The Toy: Lobster Company - Producer: Simon Jones - Quality Assurance: Paul Haycroft - Documentation: Simon Jones and Kevin Lister
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