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Post by Jeff Ledger on Feb 3, 2004 21:10:33 GMT -5
Since we lost Mike at 8bit designs, I've been searching for a new supplier of the parts required for the MAX233 Interface. I've found a supplier, and one better.
For around $15.00-$20.00 you will be able to order the max233 interface built into a 9pin connector. This kit includes the board, 9pin adapter and max233 chip in a thumb size package. All you will have to do it connect the connections to a commdore userport connector! In fact, it will not require a null modem cable to connect it to a PC.
I've got one being shipped to me for testing, after I get it working, I'll provide full details and updated specs on the site.
Jeff
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Post by Leif Bloomquist on Feb 4, 2004 12:28:17 GMT -5
connections to a commdore userport connector! In fact, it will not require a null modem cable to connect it to a PC. I've got one being shipped to me for testing, after I get it working, I'll provide full details and updated specs on the site. Jeff Commodore userport adaptors are readily had at www.digikey.com/Part number: EDC307240-ND I'm looking forward to your test results. Does this interface pass all the signals i.e. DCD, RTS, etc? TX and RX alone are sufficient for users, but Sysops need the extra signals in order to signal callers and disconnections. If you could test the interface on a BBS, maybe even just the Novaterm BBS mode, that would be great. Taht reminds me, does this interface do the "Carrier Invert" that a modem does? I've found that modems use DCD high=No call (opposite from, say, a VIC-1011A)
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Post by Dr. Video/ADDiXiON on Feb 4, 2004 13:23:11 GMT -5
In fact, it will not require a null modem cable to connect it to a PC. Whoa! really? I'm currently stuck building my null cable. Been trying to come up with a wiring scheme that works with BBS Server and Novaterm/Centipede BBS. Seems the BBS either always thinks a caller is online the minute the cable is plugged into my COM port, or it refuses to answer (sometimes garbage comes over to Hyperterminal). I've double checked my port settings. What is the correct flow control setting? Hardware/Software, or None? The pinouts I find on the net for null modems are typically NO HANDSHAKING or FULL HANDSHAKING wiring methods. I don't think FULL will work, as it always has DCD shorted. This won't work with a BBS obviously.
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Post by Jeff Ledger on Feb 4, 2004 14:51:04 GMT -5
Commodore userport adaptors are readily had at www.digikey.com/Part number: EDC307240-ND If you could test the interface on a BBS, maybe even just the Novaterm BBS mode, that would be great. Taht reminds me, does this interface do the "Carrier Invert" that a modem does? I've found that modems use DCD high=No call (opposite from, say, a VIC-1011A) I'm not sure how well this will work for the BBS end. I will test however... It looks like the perfect interface for callers out of the box. www.compsys1.com/workbench/On_top_of_the_Bench/Max233_Adapter/max233_adapter.htmlCheck out adapter: A232DB -------------I'm curious, couldn't we resolve some of these issues by simply using the AT messages at the BBS end. If I remember right don't most BBSes allow the use of the old RING, NO CARRIER, and CONNECT messages for BBS operation? I'm sure that somehow this solution is too simple, and for that reason won't work with the programs we are using... Jeff
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Post by Dr. Video/ADDiXiON on Feb 4, 2004 15:19:13 GMT -5
Only 4 pins out? I'm not sure that's gonna cut it for BBS operations. For calling out, sure, you'll have TX,RX, and GND.
BBS programs in general watch the DCD line. But, there is the issue of flow control. Hardware flow control isnt needed below 2400 I think, but at 9600 and up it becomes necessary. Right now, I'm not concerned about it. However, there may be a need for the DTR/DSR lines. RTS/CTS is for hardware flow control only, I think?
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Post by Leif Bloomquist on Feb 4, 2004 15:24:22 GMT -5
I'm curious, couldn't we resolve some of these issues by simply using the AT messages at the BBS end. If I remember right don't most BBSes allow the use of the old RING, NO CARRIER, and CONNECT messages for BBS operation? I'm sure that somehow this solution is too simple, and for that reason won't work with the programs we are using... It won't work in Jeff H's first case, where the BBS suddenly answers as soon as the cable is plugged in. That's a wiring issue. It depends if the BBS wants to see the Hayes text in conjunction with the RS-232 signals changing. If not, then we're probably OK. I've been meaning to add basic Hayes functions to my BBS Server program, but haven't had a need yet. Maybe this is it.
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Post by Jeff Ledger on Feb 5, 2004 8:55:50 GMT -5
It won't work in Jeff H's first case, where the BBS suddenly answers as soon as the cable is plugged in. That's a wiring issue. Agreed! Perhaps we should have JeffH try a 3 wire cable with the addition of hayes messages, and see if we can get it to work that way. 2-3 TX - RX 3-2 RX - TX 7-7 GR - GR Most of these BBS programs had options for selecting types of modems. We may have to look at that as well. I sent you email regarding the testing of the MAX233 interface on this end using a standard 8bit BBS. Looks like that needs to be my next project. Jeff
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Post by Dr. Video/ADDiXiON on Feb 5, 2004 12:53:45 GMT -5
Tonight I am setting time aside to methodically go through the combinations. I will document everything for the sake of having an accurate discussion and as a reference for others.
I've had some success with Hyperterminal and Novaterm BBS, the problem being that Hyperterminal won't disconnect. Using BBS Server did not solve this problem, but I believe that is due to an incorrect wiring. I will try again tonight with Leif's latest pinout and rev b software. I will try the following hardware combinations:
1. C64, VIC-1011A 2. C64, Aprotek RS232 Interface 3. C128, Aprotek RS232 Interface
I cannot use the 1011A with Centipede, because the 80 column cable is required, and this blocks the 1011A from plugging into the user port (which is why I jumped on the Aprotek when it was being auctioned - it's tiny).
When I have time, I'll go through several BBS programs to get those setups documented as well. 6485 would be a hoot on the net (for about 5 mins anyway).
Note to Leif: A BBS Server option to drop DCD/DTR on seeing '+++' will be a big help for getting the really dumb BBS programs out there to work.
I'm not BBS Server's use of RTS to control everything is politically correct, is it? Does it make more sense to control things using DTR and/or DCD? RTS is generally mentioned in documentation when talking about hardware flow control.
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Post by Snake on Feb 15, 2004 12:10:34 GMT -5
Have you given any thought to using the "Peak RS-232 Modem Interface"? I've used mine for years with Nova Term, and Various BBS software Packages (Up to 2400 Baud), with zero problems. Maybe this will help... ;D
>"1. C64, VIC-1011A" >"2. C64, Aprotek RS232 Interface" >"3. C128, Aprotek RS232 Interface"
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Post by Leif Bloomquist on Feb 16, 2004 12:59:07 GMT -5
Note to Leif: A BBS Server option to drop DCD/DTR on seeing '+++' will be a big help for getting the really dumb BBS programs out there to work. I'm not BBS Server's use of RTS to control everything is politically correct, is it? Does it make more sense to control things using DTR and/or DCD? RTS is generally mentioned in documentation when talking about hardware flow control. Good suggestion with watching for "+++", I'll look into that. Is there a BBS program in particular that needs this, so I can test it? My use of RTS/DCD originally comes from an experience at work, where we implemented a system using RS-232 over cable TV, actually. In this case, RTS on the local modem turned on DCD on the remote modem. So it is a standard, somewhere. We used this to signal that the system was ready to transmit. Then it was reinforced when my Radio Shack cable came wired that way. Plus it just plain works (for me).
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