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Post by David Murray on Nov 28, 2007 23:01:41 GMT -5
I see this board is kind of dead now, but I'm not sure where else to post. I have sort of put my shuttlecraft project on hold, due to many significant problems I was having, and I started this project a few weeks ago: galaxy22.dyndns.org/ev-talon/Interestingly enough, I had thought about starting this project for years, but was afraid it would take years to complete, However, I've only been at it for 3 weeks and I've come a long way. I might even be out doing an intial test drive two weeks from now, if all goes to plan. Of course, it would take several more weeks to complete all of the intricate stuff. But why am I writing about this on a microcontroller forum? Well, as you might imagine, all of the instruments on the dash board are now useless, except for the speedometer. That is only because this vehicle is a 94 model. Newer vehicles would probably have a computer controlled speedometer and therefor none of the guages would work in a conversion like this. So, after removing all of those usless guages like oil-pressure, engine temperature, tach, etc.. I have a lot of space and I was thinking a 20x4 character LCD would look really nice there. Then I got to thinking, maybe even two of them. One of them could replace the speedometer with large digital block-numbers on a 20x4 LCD. Technically, I could use a DTV board to run something like this. It would be easier for me in that I already know how to program it. However, a microcontroller would be better suited to such a task. For the speedometer, I'd need to actually do some timing of some pulses from the rotation of the transmission, and convert that to speed. I just wanted to get some opinions of how much time it would take a guy like me - in that, I know how to program in BASIC and assembly. I used to know pascal pretty well. I understand how to program those LCD screens since I've played with them a lot connected to my Commodore stuff (even my DTV) - But, I've never messed with a microcontroller before. How long do you think it would take me to get setup and start coding, and actually getting information to the screen? I'm not sure if I want to invest the time or not.
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Post by Jeff Ledger on Nov 28, 2007 23:14:44 GMT -5
David My current addiction would work perfectly.. For all that matter you could have three and still have at least 8 i/o pins to play with. Visit forums.parallax.comIt may take you a couple weeks to get up to full speed on this, but most of the code for what you want is already in place. Heck, I might even be convinced to work on an LCARS display for it.. Jeff
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Post by David Murray on Nov 29, 2007 8:10:23 GMT -5
haahaha.. I don't think an LCARS interface would be practical on a character LCD screen. True, if I'm designing it myself, I could go with a graphic screen. However, if I decide to go with something like this, one of my goals would be that other people could use the system in their vehicles too. I'm actually part of a local and national group devoted to electric car conversions, so I am sure there would be others interested in it. For this, I think the character LCD is more universal and compatible. People would have an easier time picking out a screen since pretty much any 20x4 character screen would work. I suppose I could also make firmware versions to utilize 16x2 screens too.
What would it cost to get started with a development kit for those Parallax chips?
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Post by David Murray on Nov 29, 2007 12:48:43 GMT -5
Oh, by the way. One thing that would help me tremendously is if there is a simulator for any of the microcontrollers out there, where it can also simulate the character LCD module. That way I could program on the PC until I am sure I have working video routines.
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Post by Jeff Ledger on Nov 29, 2007 14:31:42 GMT -5
I don't know of a way to simulate the LCD, but with the Propeller, you would have your choice of VGA, composite monitor, LCD, or hook one of each and run them all at the same time. I would recommend a SpinStudio kit from www.ucontroller.comYou'll need to order a Propeller Chip from Parallax, but I believe everything else comes with it. This will give you a good experimentation platform. Figure on spending around $100 for everything you will want. I would obtain the LCD module kit, the keyboard/mouse kit, the SD kit, and the Video/audio kit along with the Spin Studio board itself. Or if you can save a few dollars by creating a SpinStudio motherboard from a $25 Propeller protoboard which includes the Propeller chip. If you want to get an idea of the power of this micro, visit the www.ucontroller.com site, go to tutorials and read the "Propeller Cookbook" It's published by someone you know, and will give you a good idea of what you are getting into on the hardware side. From my perspective, the Propeller compares to the Commodore 64/Amiga while all of the others look like Apple ]['s (I'm going to get flamed for that, but it's true...) Caution, the Propeller is an addiction... Jeff
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Post by Jeff Ledger on Nov 29, 2007 14:50:14 GMT -5
Ah,missed an item.. and this will hurt a little.. You want a Programming plug, (propplug) You'll have to get that from Parallax as well, however there is a work around.
If you order the SpinStudio board from ucontroller, he includes my EEPROM with PropDOS upon request, which would allow you to boot the propeller in an OS, and load any program (binary) from the SD media.
Hope this doesn't have your head spinning.. If you want to chat about this, give me a time..
Jeff
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Post by David Murray on Nov 29, 2007 15:02:59 GMT -5
I went to Parallax's website earlier and looked at the propeller. it is a nice chip and all, but I think it may be quite a bit over-powered for what I'm trying to accomplish. All I need is something to count ticks from something spinning, and maybe twice a second update an LCD module. The hardest part of the coding would probably be constructing the large numbers out of smaller pieces so that I can fill a large portion of a 20x4 character LCD module with a 2-digit number display.
Perhaps if I ever do this, I might take it further and make an all-in-one solution with two LCD modules that would pretty much take care of everything in the car, including an anti-theft alarm, and monitoring of the battery levels, temperature of various components, etc. Even then, I don't think I'd ever use all the power of the propeller.
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Post by kaos116 on Nov 30, 2007 22:00:53 GMT -5
This sounds like a job for a pic microcontroller from Microchip. The whole starter kit from them is about $50. It includes a programmer, demoboard, usb cable and software. Check it out on there website. www.microchip.com/stellent/idcplg?IdcService=SS_GET_PAGE&nodeId=1406&dDocName=en023805The only downside to this is the programming languages. The 2 that are supported by Microchip are C and assembly. I do all my programming in assembly. You can find demo versions of Basic on the web. Most limit the size of a program you can write and (I don't remember which) is fully functional, but only allows certain chips to be programmed. If you have never programmed in either C or assembly, that would be a huge learning curve. That's my 2 cents....
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Post by David Murray on Dec 1, 2007 9:53:45 GMT -5
I've been chatting with Pyrofer about this and he also thinks the PIC is the way to go. I know how to program assembly language for the C64 (and other 6502 CPUs) but no idea on the PIC. It can't be that different. I used to code in C back in the 1990's but it has been so long I can't remember much about it. It probably wouldn't be too hard to pick it up again.
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Post by Jim Brain on Dec 1, 2007 12:22:31 GMT -5
I'd be interested in why folks prefer the PIC over the AVR. The PIC has such a convoluted memory map, and programming in C requires buying a license. The AVR has a free C compiler and a more sane memory map (flat like the 6502). Programmers are similarly priced, as are parts.
Jim
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Post by kaos116 on Dec 1, 2007 17:31:58 GMT -5
Free samples :-)
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Post by Jim Brain on Dec 1, 2007 21:54:57 GMT -5
Atmel appears to do the same. Any other reasons?
Jim
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Post by kaos116 on Dec 2, 2007 16:16:24 GMT -5
I didn't know Atmel started giving free samples. When I first looked into microcontrollers, Microchip was the only one giving them out. If Atmel is giving them out, I can't think of any other reason for a new comer not to look at them. I am used of using Pics for everything now.
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Post by iamdenteddisk on May 6, 2008 23:18:49 GMT -5
hey man I have been following this discussion and realy I do belive the bs2 boardof Ed2 <-is fiting the application it's up to you but , why knowingly under design a modern application?,I would simply go buy a used pawnshop 486/586 laptop ,as a maincontroler-then buy a bs2board of ed2 a week till you are done with all you want to connect. these boards have 14 pins you can read or write to and 2 power pins <wich can be read to test staus or fault,a 9vconnector wich will accept5-15vDC ,simply dedicate some pins I suggest8 to being a data bus to comunicate with other boards,the wrest can be localsystem&sensors each "subsystem board will need to be programed to do its job+read a byte,pass a byte then ignore the databuss till its inturupt is called ,this simplify's the job and 2 more things ,you save in development of a new 8 bit computer wich if it worked is kewl but not modern,and you got the 486/586 power/ connectivity of the laptop or wireless opperation usualy infrared too. the bs2 answers to a debug program wich will be your system terminal"window/gui"in your OS-mine sounds like kit from knight rider when it answers questions,or prompts for input when I first got speech to work it called me by name then i had it reply "yes michal"for gigles now it says driver.. it comes with a kit called "what's a microcontroler",the book leads you through connecting all devices you said you wanted to implement and some of them come with it/ many are available < I realize im saying this because it is how I did things but its the cheap rout to modern capability's +the sub systems help too as it means not all systems fail at once,built-in localizing diagnosis as it will tell the main system wich subsystem's have faults ---->built in plasma screen and be capable of posting in this forum.
laptop50-400$ depending on what it is and you could chain the usb's together to reprogram or update each subsystem as well. bs2whole kit-70$ radioshack need1 additional bs2's 45$ online you got 6digital-analog pins to wread/write at any point you add a board wich all answer to 1 through a bus and it answers to the laptop by usb ,kinda prety I think. and it comes with an acredited collage course in microcontrolers $saveing 28k$any tech school>some use this kit for ciriculum.
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